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Chapter 42 [message #7255] Fri, 17 August 2012 20:15 Go to next message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
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Registered: April 2012
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I (as I'm sure most people here have) have read The Saga of Tuck at least twice. And both times I've come away feeling that Debbie set Tu/Val up to fail in this episode. The setup may not have been conscious but it is still there.

I suspect that Debbie has so many issues that only Lisa may be able to stay with her long term.

The main issue to me is Debbie pushing Val to go have fun even though Debbie suffers from nearly insane jealousy.
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7258] Sat, 18 August 2012 08:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
stanman  is currently offline stanman
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Who does she want, Tuck, or Val?
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7262] Sat, 18 August 2012 16:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
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Registered: April 2012
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stanman wrote on Sat, 18 August 2012 05:00

Who does she want, Tuck, or Val?

Rolling Eyes That was the problem I think. Debbie wanted Val but had Tuck. She wants a guy but any guy she can walk on is going to be apt to be at least a little apt to swing toward men.

As does Tuck Debbie has/had serious trust issues. They both have reasons but that makes them bad choices for relationships. Put them together and the potential for problems got larger the longer the relationship lasted.

Of course Debbie could have done the right thing (as could Val have later with Travis) of being on Tuck's doorstep begging forgiveness...

My main point is that this chapter and the one where Val is caught by Sarah are the break points of the story. Debbie was irrational. Sarah was irrational.

When the parents (most likely Sarah) made a rule that there was to be no sex outside the house what did she really expect? It was a rule that she could not enforce. Indeed until Jill and Pam after the sleepover (where I bet their parents [especially Pam's] believe that she was with a girl) before he had girls as guests.

Also a close read of the time before the convention when Bill essentially tells Tuck *I Know you're going to have sex, just be safe* flies in the face of this rule. So Bill later is a bit of a hypocrite for fining Tuck over this rule.
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7267] Sat, 18 August 2012 22:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sir Lee  is currently offline Sir Lee
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Uh, Anne, can you give a ref to the "no sex outside the house" rule? I really don't remember it, and I was unable to find it by searching.

But, from what I understood of Chapter 101, having sex outside the house was NOT why Tuck was fined/grounded/comm-locked. That was for systematically lying to the parents about his doings AND exposing the family to risk in the form of lawsuits and such, because of his "babysitting in Val-Mode" activities.

If there is such a "no sex outside home" rule, I expect it's more like a guideline to not do it in risky situations, such as in the back seat of a car parked in a dark alley. But I would have to find the relevant passage to see if my interpretation makes sense in context.


Don't call me Shirley. You will surely make me surly.
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7268] Sun, 19 August 2012 09:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
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Registered: April 2012
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I thought it was in 101 but it is actually in 119. Here is the relevant passage:
Quote
From 09:38 25 Oct
"Eugene," Sheila said quietly, "your parents are very upset over some things they found out yesterday. They said you broke some rules, about going places without notification, and about having sexual relations outside your house."

That doesn't change my mind that the rule was irrational nor that her (Sarah's) response to finding Val at the mall was irrational.

That is not to say that most parents wouldn't be pretty past rational to discover something of that magnitude. However this rule is one way, plus what Bill says about Tuck knowing that his mom would blow up that Sarah set Tuck up to fail.

Rules that cannot reasonably be enforced lead to disobedience. They also lead to Chaos.

[Updated on: Sun, 19 August 2012 09:56]

Re: Chapter 42 [message #7273] Sun, 19 August 2012 14:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
stanman  is currently offline stanman
Messages: 292
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Is Debbie a lesbian, or bisexual?
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7277] Thu, 23 August 2012 23:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
Messages: 355
Registered: April 2012
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I don't think that Debbie is quite sure of that. She keeps dating guys with very little success. Yet I suspect that she is well aware that her relationship with Lisa is not entirely healthy.

Indeed Lisa seems to be very much in a codependent situation.
Re: Chapter 42 [message #7278] Fri, 24 August 2012 05:15 Go to previous message
stanman  is currently offline stanman
Messages: 292
Registered: May 2008
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Might be why she likes Tuck/Val.
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