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Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4136] Thu, 01 September 2005 10:08 Go to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
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1 September

Valerie and Travis continue to enjoy Labor Day together. Their spirits are only somewhat dampened by Travis's friends dropping in unexpectly. Tuck then wanders over to Mike's for a homework party before staggering home to sleep.

Reference is made in this chaper to the death of Princess Di. This is one of very few details in the story pointing to the specific year it occurs.

I'm just reusing the example from when I first proposed doing this; I guess my acutal style has tended to be a bit more terse.
Today In Tuck History: September 2 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4137] Sat, 03 September 2005 01:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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2 September

School, Sitting, Sabrina gives Tuck some clothes.

As close to an "average" day as I can recall seeing in the story...
Today In Tuck History: September 3 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4138] Sat, 03 September 2005 11:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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3 September

Nightmares; Dobson talks with Tuck about Field Day; various Phone Calls.
Today In Tuck History: September 4 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4140] Sun, 04 September 2005 04:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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4 September

Nightmares; Tuck gets an inspiration regarding the Laptop; Sitting; A game of cards with Travis's friends.
Today In Tuck History: September 5 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4142] Mon, 05 September 2005 03:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
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5 September

Nightmares; School; Dinner with Travis at the Parkers; seeing a play.

Just a reminder, people: this thread is for discussion. Jump on in if something catches your eye!
Today In Tuck History: September 6 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4144] Tue, 06 September 2005 20:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lurker
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6 September

Therapy; Tuck's car was keyed(vandalized); an afternoon with the guys; James T. Cooper thinks Tuck's gay for baking cookies...

(OtherEric - Pardon my presumption, I didn't want to lose continuity so I took the liberty for adding today)
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 6 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4145] Tue, 06 September 2005 22:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
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lurker wrote on Tue, 06 September 2005 17:16


(OtherEric - Pardon my presumption, I didn't want to lose continuity so I took the liberty for adding today)


Not a problem. I would have posted something before the end of the day; but I'm running behind on getting the entries ready. I appreciate you saving me today's work.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 6 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4146] Wed, 07 September 2005 00:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I'm glad anybody was able to post; the server was down for about 16 hours. Smile

- Erin
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4147] Wed, 07 September 2005 03:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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So I noticed; I would have created an entry for the day on the fly if I had been able to get on. I got ahead again today; I've got at least two weeks done now...
Today In Tuck History: September 7 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4148] Wed, 07 September 2005 03:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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7 September

A good night's sleep, for once; no breakfast; Sunday dinner.

Today In Tuck History: September 8 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4149] Thu, 08 September 2005 11:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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8 September

Nightmares; planning for Field Day; checking voicemail.

From here on out, it would be quicker just to mention the rare occasions where Tuck doesn't have nightmares. But I've been doing it so far; and now that we're in the home stretch it seems easiest just to continue...
Today In Tuck History: September 9 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4150] Fri, 09 September 2005 10:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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9 September

Nightmares; school; a movie with Travis.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4151] Sat, 10 September 2005 04:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Not much to comment on, but

2 September
As someone pointed out in the Chapter by Chapter section, this is the one day when Mike seems to be in synch with Tuck's nightmare ("we went over the embankment and I fell for a long time before I hit the ground").

6 September
Among the Littles, they picked up James, Paul and Matt (though the latter doesn't even get a speaking part in the narrative), and Kelly for once isn't present. Apparently nobody wants to spend any more time with Bob than they have to.

7 September
We discover that the "Valerie" voicemail box still exists, and that Jack's still using it, though Tuck hasn't bothered to monitor it. Tuck doesn't have time to tell him anything in this conversation, but it's odd that when he calls him back the following day and leaves a message, he doesn't tell him to leave future messages in the main box.
Today In Tuck History: September 10 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4152] Sat, 10 September 2005 11:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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10 September

School; phone call with Jack.
Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4153] Sun, 11 September 2005 12:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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11 September

Nightmares; breakfast with the parents; medical tests; lunch with Dana; and we are introduced to the not-yet-named Mister Cheddar Underfoot.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4154] Mon, 12 September 2005 04:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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OtherEric wrote on Sun, 11 September 2005 09:22

11 September

...medical tests; lunch with Dana...

13:17 11 Sep

"You didnít ever notice your testicles hadnít descended?" Dana confirmed. "...When I thought about it, which was rare, I figured that if I really needed to Iíd have someone look into it when I cared," I shrugged. "I never thought Iíd need to be fertile in high school." "And since we already had an assurance from that doctor up in New York that it was 'normal' and 'okay'," Dad sighed, "we didnít bother checking up on it."

This seems to suggest a relatively recent medical exam in New York, with Bill present. We know that Tuck spent a summer learning to cook with Aunt Trish, and Tuck has said that the family normally takes a camping trip in New York in December. But it seems unlikely that Tuck would be getting a routine exam back there, and it's been a few years since his last respiratory attack.
Today In Tuck History: September 12 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4155] Mon, 12 September 2005 10:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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12 September

Nightmare; school; sitting a sick Ricky; date with Travis.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4156] Mon, 12 September 2005 15:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Brooke  is currently offline Brooke
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Eric wrote on Mon, 12 September 2005 01:05

OtherEric wrote on Sun, 11 September 2005 09:22

11 September

...medical tests; lunch with Dana...

13:17 11 Sep

"You didn't ever notice your testicles hadn't descended?" Dana confirmed. "...When I thought about it, which was rare, I figured that if I really needed to I'd have someone look into it when I cared," I shrugged. "I never thought I'd need to be fertile in high school." "And since we already had an assurance from that doctor up in New York that it was 'normal' and 'okay'," Dad sighed, "we didn't bother checking up on it."

This seems to suggest a relatively recent medical exam in New York, with Bill present. We know that Tuck spent a summer learning to cook with Aunt Trish, and Tuck has said that the family normally takes a camping trip in New York in December. But it seems unlikely that Tuck would be getting a routine exam back there, and it's been a few years since his last respiratory attack.


It suggestsd no such thing to me. Rather, since there are previous references to the Tuckers having lived in New York, and specifically to Tuck's doctor when he was born there being someone other than Dana, I see this as a reference to the same doctor that performed surgery to relocate Tuck's urethra shortly after he was born. Without notifying his parents.

That sort of BS is *way* too common in the medical profession when it comes to intersexed babies.

So if he was still Tuck's pediatrician when they lived in New York, then odds are that he also "reassured" them. Way too many doctors have that "god complex".

Me, I'm wondering if after things calm down a bit, Sarah won't try to look up said doctor with the intent of seeing if there's something legal that can be done about his failure to inform Tuck's parents of Tuck's abnormalities.

And if there's nothing legal that can be done, I wouldn't put it past the Tuckers to arrange something not legal. Something like what happened to Nickerson, only more focused.

ps. I don't know what you used to get that quote from the story into your message, but it messed with the appostrophes. Turned them into some weird character (probably MS "smart quotes")

[Updated on: Mon, 12 September 2005 15:28]

Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4157] Mon, 12 September 2005 19:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Brooke wrote on Mon, 12 September 2005 12:24

It suggested no such thing to me. Rather, since there are previous references to the Tuckers having lived in New York, and specifically to Tuck's doctor when he was born there being someone other than Dana, I see this as a reference to the same doctor that performed surgery to relocate Tuck's urethra shortly after he was born. Without notifying his parents.

Trouble is, the discussion is about the testicles not descending, and nobody'd be asking about that in the case of, say, a four-to-six year old, or automatically assuming that what was "normal" then still is, ten years later.

Brooke, continued

ps. I don't know what you used to get that quote from the story into your message, but it messed with the apostrophes. Turned them into some weird character (probably MS "smart quotes")

I discovered that a few weeks ago (I've stored it as a PageMaker document) and I've been replacing all the double-quotes and single-quotes since then. But I missed the apostrophes -- sorry. (The marks all look normal on my screen until someone quotes me.)
Today In Tuck History: September 13 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4158] Tue, 13 September 2005 03:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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13 September

Rescuing Mike; therapy; remedial culinary training for James; party at Tuck's.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4159] Wed, 14 September 2005 01:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Eric wrote on Mon, 12 September 2005 16:24

Brooke wrote on Mon, 12 September 2005 12:24

It suggested no such thing to me. Rather, since there are previous references to the Tuckers having lived in New York, and specifically to Tuck's doctor when he was born there being someone other than Dana, I see this as a reference to the same doctor that performed surgery to relocate Tuck's urethra shortly after he was born. Without notifying his parents.

Trouble is, the discussion is about the testicles not descending, and nobody'd be asking about that in the case of, say, a four-to-six year old, or automatically assuming that what was "normal" then still is, ten years later.


Well, we don't know exactly but people also tend to not think much about that sort of thing.

Brooke, continued

ps. I don't know what you used to get that quote from the story into your message, but it messed with the apostrophes. Turned them into some weird character (probably MS "smart quotes")

I discovered that a few weeks ago (I've stored it as a PageMaker document) and I've been replacing all the double-quotes and single-quotes since then. But I missed the apostrophes -- sorry. (The marks all look normal on my screen until someone quotes me.)[/quote]

If you are running a version of Windows that can open an MS-DOS window, you can try doing some things in there to check.

But easier is picking a different font. In the font I use, the Windows things are angled, but the "real" quotes and apostrophes are straight up and down.

I also notice that sort of thing when I paste stuff into my email or html editors. The spell checkers complain about contractions that have the single quote in them instead of an apostrophe.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 13 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4160] Wed, 14 September 2005 02:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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OtherEric wrote on Tue, 13 September 2005 00:16

13 September

Rescuing Mike; remedial culinary training for James; party at Tuck's.

1. First time I read this it made me think of the connecting strings in Bek D. Corbin's Jordan Winters stories, though when I extracted it there was less similarity than I'd thought originally:

03:29 13 Sep

...Mike was lying on my bed next to me, where I could watch him. "I can see the chi," Mike said. "The chi, connecting us." "You're hallucinating," I reminded him. "Yeah, but it is like so cool," he said admiringly, looking at me. "I mean, it's like ribbons and interconnections, like, like this really complex network between us, and it's glowing with life and love and positive energy and stuff, and it's balanced between us, the yin and the yang..."


2. I did like the way James' mother took the whole "Starfleet memo" in stride.

3. I had trouble with the Tuck-in-makeup idea; about half the people at the party know that it's not something unusual, and have to make sure the other half don't find out.

[Updated on: Fri, 16 September 2005 01:11]

Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4161] Wed, 14 September 2005 03:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
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14 September

Sleepover at Tuck's, which extends into Sunday dinner with a break to explain things to the parents.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4162] Wed, 14 September 2005 19:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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OtherEric wrote on Wed, 14 September 2005 00:00

14 September

Sleepover at Tuck's, which extends into Sunday dinner with a break to explain things to the parents.


I'm trying to picture some point in the future when Tuck asks the parentals if Val can have a sleepover at the house. Smile

After all, at some point if "Val" isn't done away with, there are going to be sleepover invites again. And I can see sarah or Bill wanting to have a lot more control the first time.

This would, of course require a lot of acceptance on all sides. But it might be interesting. (Just imagine Brian's reaction!)
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4163] Thu, 15 September 2005 03:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I wonder whether Mike's parents ever found out. (He's lucky Bill and Sarah didn't call them...)

Eric
Today In Tuck History: September 15 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4164] Thu, 15 September 2005 03:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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15 September

Nightmares; a fight at school; sitting gets messy;
Today In Tuck History: September 16 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4165] Fri, 16 September 2005 03:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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16 September

Nightmares; school; Quake on laptop while sitting; and a short date with Travis.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 14 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4166] Sat, 17 September 2005 04:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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One more thing re the sleepover:

Mike and Tuck draw a clear distinction between the "urban-tactical...heavy-duty kit" that Tuck wore for the rescue of Mike and the "social work" gear they wear for their covert operations.

I got the impression that they didn't consider the difference a matter of degree (heavy duty = social work, with more weapons) but nearly an apples-to-oranges difference, though one that fortunately looked similar enough to satisfy people's curiosity.

The difference between pranksters and soldiers?

02:11 14 Sep

"I donít think you're telling us everything," Kathy stated. "And I'm not going to," I answered. "You're not cleared for that information."

Is it just the firearms that Tuck's concerned about or other things? The family activity at the gun range is no secret, so nobody's going to have trouble conceiving of Tuck taking firearms and ammunition with him on the mission...
Today In Tuck History: September 17 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4167] Sat, 17 September 2005 05:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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17 September

Nighmares; school; and a surreal evening at home.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 14 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4168] Sat, 17 September 2005 05:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Eric wrote on Sat, 17 September 2005 01:08

Mike and Tuck draw a clear distinction between the "urban-tactical...heavy-duty kit" that Tuck wore for the rescue of Mike and the "social work" gear they wear for their covert operations.

I got the impression that they didn't consider the difference a matter of degree (heavy duty = social work, with more weapons) but nearly an apples-to-oranges difference, though one that fortunately looked similar enough to satisfy people's curiosity.

I'm not sure, but I have the vague impression the "heavy-duty" kit is Dad-purchased and approved, and includes, for example, the various drugs Tuck had availaible when Dana was called. The "social work" kit would have been purchaced by Tuck and Mike, and the contents and pack itself are likely from completely different suppliers, even where the basic components overlap. So, even if a social work pack is lost, they wouldn't be able to learn anything about the heavy-duty kits from it.
That's pretty much pure specuation on my part; with all the usual "it's two AM disclaimers" on it, but I think that's a large part of it.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 18-22 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4172] Fri, 23 September 2005 01:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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18 September

Nightmares; MRI; sitting with David & Gary again; Field Day practice.


19 September

Nightmares; Field day; sitting; Putt-Putt golf with Travis.


20 September

Detention turns into tech support and leads to dinner with Dobson and his wife.

This is one of my favorite episodes; Ellen has a real knack for writing about tech work in a fun way. (The sequence in the original Tuck Seasons was also a favorite...)


21 September

End of dinner and a brief talk with Mom; Breakfast; Sunday dinner; Tuck's car is found damaged; Mike sleeps over.


22 September

School; intel gathering on the car; preparations for retaliation begin.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 18-22 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4173] Fri, 23 September 2005 06:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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OtherEric wrote on Thu, 22 September 2005 22:38

20 September

...dinner with Dobson and his wife.

Tuck finds Dobson acutely uncomfortable with the concept of Travis as Valerie's boyfriend. Makes me wonder what if anything he knew about the events of that final night at the convention. Would someone who knew about it remember that Dobson was associated with Val and Debbie (supposedly as co-workers) and spread the news to him? If not, did he draw any conclusion from Valerie's presence at the concert, a girls'-night-out that didn't include Debbie? It seems too much to expect Dobson to have paid attention to Tuck's determination to avoid Debbie at school. (Which reminds me: I wonder if Tuck, when he was adjusting school schedules, made sure that he and Debbie weren't in any of the same classes.)

Eric
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 6 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4174] Fri, 23 September 2005 12:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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lurker wrote on Tue, 06 September 2005 19:16

6 September
...James T. Cooper thinks Tuck's gay for baking cookies...



I always thought that was a strange assumption on his part myself;
especially for someone appearing to be such strong fans of a forward
viewing series like ST...

Of course, just because he's smart, a geek, and a ST fan doesn't
mean he couldn't have a few irrational assumptions...I just thought
it slightly strange at the time.

Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4175] Fri, 23 September 2005 13:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Brooke wrote on Wed, 14 September 2005 00:07

ps. I don't know what you used to get that quote from the story into your message, but it messed with the apostrophes. Turned them into some weird character (probably MS "smart quotes")


Eric wrote on Wed, 14 September 2005 00:07


I discovered that a few weeks ago (I've stored it as a PageMaker document) and I've been replacing all the double-quotes and single-quotes since then. But I missed the apostrophes -- sorry. (The marks all look normal on my screen until someone quotes me.)


Brooke, continued on Wed, 14 September 2005 00:07


If you are running a version of Windows that can open an MS-DOS window, you can try doing some things in there to check.

But easier is picking a different font. In the font I use, the Windows things are angled, but the "real" quotes and apostrophes are straight up and down.

I also notice that sort of thing when I paste stuff into my email or html editors. The spell checkers complain about contractions that have the single quote in them instead of an apostrophe.



Another suggestion if you're using MS-Windows is to download the
excelent 'Metapad' notepade replacement and open the text or
cut-n-paste the text in there using its powerful search and replace
function to fix all the errors. I use it often when converting html
fanfics to a palm document format, since going from html to text
seems to save a lot on file sizes! Here's a link:

[ http://www.liquidninja.com/metapad/ ]

--iWindoze aka bornagainpenguin
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 6 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4176] Fri, 23 September 2005 13:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Well, TOS was undoubtedly sexist but not overmuch for the times. But I thought J.T.'s attitude showed him as an individual, it made him large, containing contradictions. Smile
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 18-22 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4177] Fri, 23 September 2005 13:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I'm certain Tuck took all precautions about avoiding Debbie.

As for what Dobson knew, well Ellen has a good opportunity in the current 3rd person narrative to tell us but so far she hasn't. If she wanted us to know that for certain, I'm sure she would.

Hmm. My first comment above is a comment on the story in the frame of the story, but the second is a one about writing the story from outside the story. I seem to make a lot of the second sort and I think that is because "Tuck" fascinates me on two levels. First as story and second as storycraft. It excels as both. Kudos to Ellen.

- Erin
Today In Tuck History: September 23 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4178] Fri, 23 September 2005 21:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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23 September

Nightmare; social work; school; Cheddar gets his name.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 18-22 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4179] Sat, 24 September 2005 04:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Erin Halfelven wrote on Fri, 23 September 2005 10:14

As for what Dobson knew, well Ellen has a good opportunity in the current 3rd person narrative to tell us but so far she hasn't. If she wanted us to know that for certain, I'm sure she would.

If he did know that they'd had a violent breakup, Debbie's activities of the third-person week had to confuse him. (Probably leaving him with the same question that half our cast has: is Debbie using Tuck's misfortune to pursue her own secret agenda?)

Eric
Today In Tuck History: September 24 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4180] Sat, 24 September 2005 15:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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24 September

Optometrist; lunch out with Dad & Brian gets tense; and Mike visits at Tuck's house.
Today In Tuck History: September 25 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4181] Sun, 25 September 2005 19:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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25 September

Test results; the Tuck's biology 101 class; family therapy session; and Tuck lies awake thinking.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 25 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4182] Mon, 26 September 2005 00:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lurker
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There is a large body of discussion of Chapt 96 (in the Chapter by Chapter section) on the physical speculations of what Ellen presented for Tuck and the revelations brought out on this day in Tuck History. Therefore, no point in delving here on that.
I enjoyed this day's story events because it evoked the age-old question of nature vs. nurture in why Tuck is and how the character may evolve in the coming Tuck time weeks. My personal bias has always been nature over nurture from reading about studies on twins. So, when I first read this, it made me realize that I was quick to put Tuck into a character box and I kept banging my head thinking don't do that! Evil Twisted Evil Ellen is going to kick it out of that character box and destroy your fundamental assumptions of how the world behaves.
Today In Tuck History: September 26 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4183] Mon, 26 September 2005 11:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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26 September

No school; everybody drops by; Sitting; Tuck & Mike go camping.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 26: Logistics [message #4187] Tue, 27 September 2005 02:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Is everyone satisfied now with the conclusion that Susan knew the plan and came along in Mike's car so that she could drive Bill's car (which Tuck had) home?
Today In Tuck History: September 27 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4188] Tue, 27 September 2005 22:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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27 September

Tuck & Mike on a hike.
Today In Tuck History: September 28 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4191] Wed, 28 September 2005 12:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
Messages: 589
Registered: September 2003
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28 September

End of hike; breakfast; Tuck finally gets some sleep.
Today In Tuck History: September 29 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4195] Thu, 29 September 2005 11:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
Messages: 589
Registered: September 2003
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29 September

Nightmares; School; Sitting; a date with Travis called on account of tiredness.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 29 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4196] Fri, 30 September 2005 08:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eric  is currently offline Eric
Messages: 641
Registered: January 2003
Location: San Francisco
Senior Member
An interesting discrepancy?

*** 20:25 29 Sep

"Hush my darrrrr-lin', donít you cry. Guard'yan, annnnngel wonít let you die," I sang along with Belinda, both of us cranked up as loud as we could get without distortion. "Can you hear them? They talk about us telling lies. Well, thatís no surprise. Can you see them? See right through them. They have a shield, nothing gets thruuuuu the field. Doesn't matter what they say in the jealous games people play, hey-hey-hey! Our lips are sealed..."


actual lyrics:

[Jane:]Hush, my darling
Don't you cry
Quiet, angel
Forget their lies

[Belinda:]Can you hear them
They talk about us
Telling lies
Well that's no surprise

Can you see them
See right through them
They have no shield
No secrets to reveal

It doesn't matter what they say
In the jealous games people play
Our lips are sealed...


Listening to it, I can confirm the lyric in Jane's part; Tuck's singing that one wrong.

The second is less clear -- it's supposed to be a repeat of the song's first verse, but some of the disputed lines do sound at least slightly different this second time through. I can hear Tuck's lyric if I listen for it, but I don't know how much of that is suggestion. (FWIW, if it had been written the way Tuck sang it, the lyric ought to have been, "WE have a shield/nothing gets through the field", and Belinda definitely sings "they" and not "we". A Google search for "nothing gets through the field" came up empty, so it doesn't appear that anyone's transcribing it that way online.)

Tuck's lyrics do seem to me to fit the story or his state of mind a little bit better than the real ones, though.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 29 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4197] Fri, 30 September 2005 09:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
Messages: 684
Registered: September 2002
Senior Member
Song lyrics are a bitch-kitty; a lot worse 'back then' than they are now, too , by a long shot (the expansion of WWW-as-database has helped a great deal). I'm convinced that singers do not always use the 'proper' lyrics in the song (though almost all the time they do); their, uhm, artistic and therefore atypical pronunciations do not help. And printers of album covers and CD inserts may also make mistakes.

In this particular instance, I think (vague recollection as opposed to no recollection) I actually decided not to use the 'correct' lyrics (as I could find them) and went with a more 'audio-based' interpretation for Tuck to sing.

Does anyone know how this interacts with ASCAP/BMI fascistic enforcement of song copyrights?


Ellen
nosig
Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4198] Fri, 30 September 2005 10:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
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30 September

Nightmares; armpit lump; School; a flooded basement; Date with Travis; Mike sleeps over.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4199] Fri, 30 September 2005 15:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Erin Halfelven  is currently offline Erin Halfelven
Messages: 712
Registered: September 2002
Location: Surf City, USA
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Administrator
We're coming up on the final month of this calendar. Other Eric and those who have helped him deserve our thanks. And thanks to Ellen for making the calendar possible and desired. Smile

- Erin
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4200] Fri, 30 September 2005 20:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lurker
Messages: 197
Registered: May 2004
Senior Member
It's hard to believe that a year's almost gone with this calendar thread. Following the story along, reading in "real time", provided a different feel to the events as they occurred. For me, it seems that Tuck's psychological metamorphosis is rather sudden with this perspective. Anyways, I thought it has been worthwhile...
I remember in gradeschool, up till third grade, the teacher would set aside a half hour every other day and read some part of a chapter of fiction like The Phantom Toll Booth or a biographical like Farewell to Manzanar to us. Rereading Tuck by the calendar was like this.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4201] Fri, 30 September 2005 22:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
Messages: 589
Registered: September 2003
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Thanks for the kudos; it's nice to be appreciated. Lurker captured exactly what I wanted to demonstrate with this; as well as using the threads to spur discussion. Just as a heads-up, October 9 will be the last day I'm doing this. I could figure out the timeline a few days more, and might if I'm ever crazy enough to try this again; but for now I figure it's a good stopping point.

Which brings up another point: I am not going to do this again; at least not this year. If anybody else wants to take up the mantle, I give full permission to use my entries. For that matter, I hereby give permission for anybody to use any of my work on the timeline in any way they want; as long as it meets Ellen's rules. Credit would be apprecated but is not a requirement. And a computer crash prevents me from sending out a list with just the entries; I would only make that available to people who I know from discussions here have read the whole saga, in any case. But the point is moot...
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4202] Sat, 01 October 2005 03:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Eric  is currently offline Eric
Messages: 641
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Location: San Francisco
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Not sure what point there'd be in actually writing it again. OtherEric's version is still posted; if anyone wants to organize a new daily reading of it and post additional thoughts along the way, they can certainly do that.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 30 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #4204] Sat, 01 October 2005 10:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtherEric  is currently offline OtherEric
Messages: 589
Registered: September 2003
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Eric wrote on Sat, 01 October 2005 00:44

Not sure what point there'd be in actually writing it again. OtherEric's version is still posted; if anyone wants to organize a new daily reading of it and post additional thoughts along the way, they can certainly do that.

The major reason I could see for reposting the whole thing would be so it shows up under "today's posts". But I don't know how many people use that regularly, instead of logging in and following the stars.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 11 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #7322] Wed, 05 September 2012 00:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
Messages: 355
Registered: April 2012
Senior Member
Eric wrote on Mon, 12 September 2005 01:05


This seems to suggest a relatively recent medical exam in New York, with Bill present. We know that Tuck spent a summer learning to cook with Aunt Trish, and Tuck has said that the family normally takes a camping trip in New York in December. But it seems unlikely that Tuck would be getting a routine exam back there, and it's been a few years since his last respiratory attack.


Not necessarily. While it is not necessarily normal for a boy not to have his testes descend until puberty it is also not unusual for them to float up and down until that point. So an exam at 5 years old might result in the doctor saying, 'don't worry too much about it until he enters puberty.' Since for all intents and purposes Tuck's parents believed he was experiencing a late puberty rather than developing a female puberty they had told him not to worry about it. However an alert doc would have made some more effort to discover what was going on as extended periods of having his testes undescended would be apt to cause a boy to be sterile when he matured.

Indeed it could cause some of the problems that Tuck is experiencing. However it should be noted that even in babies the testes are usually very evident. Which is why the first doc or doc Trebel should have been asking questions. This is especially true of Dana as she should have done enough of a physical to discover the discrepancy earlier than this. Indeed with my stepson we had the doc notice his testes were not down all the time at 6 and by 8 decide to do a little surgery to make sure that they did stay down.

It seems odd that this was missed when Tuck was in the ER (which he was several times for pneumonia)previously.
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #7326] Fri, 07 September 2012 05:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
stanman  is currently offline stanman
Messages: 292
Registered: May 2008
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Maybe the medical authorities were keeping tabs on Tuck and prevented any discovery
Re: Today In Tuck History: September 1 (WARNING: May Contain Spoilers!) [message #7328] Fri, 07 September 2012 18:28 Go to previous message
Anne  is currently offline Anne
Messages: 355
Registered: April 2012
Senior Member
stanman wrote on Fri, 07 September 2012 02:10

Maybe the medical authorities were keeping tabs on Tuck and prevented any discovery


Rolling Eyes Anne Boggles at Stan who is an idiot. Conspiracy theories will abound. But I think this takes the cake. Medical authorities would not do that. The main reason is that most all of them want to help their patients and while they will hide information from time to time most of them will not hide something that they feels will negatively impact their patient if the patient discovers it. As a long term case of undescended testes would negatively impact the future fertility prospects of a young male the issue would have (should have) been spotted and discussed at length before Tuck turned 16.

Thus Dana would not deliberately keep information back from Tuck's parents. First because she says that she will be checking her other patients which means that she may have not given Tuck a full physical including a palpitation for hernias (this would have discovered the undescended testes)which seems odd except that Tuck does no sports.
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