Home » Tuck Talk » Chapter discussion of Tuck Season... » DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up.
DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6919] Tue, 05 July 2011 09:41 Go to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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Would've been up last night, but for some reason, Hurricane Electric wasn't taking SSH logins or my account password. Checking the Internet suggests that they made a boo-boo with /etc/hosts.deny and locked everyone out. 'Tis better - that is, working - this morning. Still, not the kind of anomaly I need...

Ellen
nosig
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6920] Tue, 05 July 2011 11:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OtteryLexa  is currently offline OtteryLexa
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Woohoo!
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6921] Wed, 06 July 2011 02:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mkemp  is currently offline mkemp
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Oh, my; oh, my; oh, my.
Absolutely priceless.

Thanks.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6922] Wed, 06 July 2011 14:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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Did anyone look at the Gallery?

Ellen
nosig
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6924] Wed, 06 July 2011 15:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CaroL  is currently offline CaroL
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Thanks for the Double Shot Ellen. It lit up my day better than fireworks.

I was amused that both Darla and Jane were amazed by Val's two toned hair color. Had they forgotten (or blocked out) that she had that done while she was on the run?
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6925] Thu, 07 July 2011 01:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Doragoon  is currently offline Doragoon
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Quote:

Did anyone look at the Gallery?

Ellen


For some reason I feel like the gallery spoils my enjoyment of the story. However, I feel like they are another insight into mind and method of one of my favourite authors. So I check it out.

I guess even though I don't like looking at the gallery, I like that it's there. Especially in another five years when I'm re-reading everything again, it will be much better.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6926] Thu, 07 July 2011 15:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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Doragoon wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 06:12

For some reason I feel like the gallery spoils my enjoyment of the story.

Could you PLEASE explain your feelings in greater detail? This boggles me...

Ellen
nosig
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6927] Thu, 07 July 2011 15:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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CaroL wrote on Wed, 06 July 2011 20:39

Had they forgotten (or blocked out) that she had that done while she was on the run?

It was that Valerie went out blonde, but didn't come back that way. It's, er, Not Done for a student to lose their wig/hair while out...
I could probably have worded their objections/exclamations better.

Ellen
nosig

[Updated on: Thu, 07 July 2011 15:26]

Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6928] Thu, 07 July 2011 17:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mkemp  is currently offline mkemp
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Ellen Hayes wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 12:23

Doragoon wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 06:12

For some reason I feel like the gallery spoils my enjoyment of the story.

Could you PLEASE explain your feelings in greater detail? This boggles me...

Ellen
nosig


For some, forming a mental image of the characters in a story is part of the enjoyment. For others the image is taken from characters in movies or TV programs ("Jane really looks like <ftib>".)

Reading something that someone else has written is a rather idiosyncratic activity.

Marten.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6929] Thu, 07 July 2011 18:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
JenC  is currently offline JenC
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mkemp wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 22:19

Ellen Hayes wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 12:23

Doragoon wrote on Thu, 07 July 2011 06:12

For some reason I feel like the gallery spoils my enjoyment of the story.

Could you PLEASE explain your feelings in greater detail? This boggles me...

Ellen
nosig


For some, forming a mental image of the characters in a story is part of the enjoyment. For others the image is taken from characters in movies or TV programs ("Jane really looks like <ftib>".)

Reading something that someone else has written is a rather idiosyncratic activity.

Marten.



I found the gallery useful and interesting. When reading I tend not to form mental images, which is odd as I am usually a very visual person. There have been a few times in Tuck & Saga where I have had to look up pictures so I know what is being written about. So the gallery is useful as you have done some of this for me.

Anyway I enjoyed the last couple of chapters. It may just be me but they felt similar to the last few Saga chapters. There seemed to be similar themes and activities, although Seasons feels a little lighter to me. The Saga is in a happier place than it used to be it still has darkness lurking under the surface, whilst I don't get this with Seasons.

Jen
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6930] Fri, 08 July 2011 03:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Doragoon  is currently offline Doragoon
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Quote:

Could you PLEASE explain your feelings in greater detail? This boggles me...

it kinda feels like a spoiler. I _REALLY_ enjoy your writing. I get really into it and having other things floating through my head while I'm reading is kinda distracting. I like to focus on the story. how they look doesn't matter to me. it's more about the words.

as far as what the car looks like, it's kinda like wondering what a spaceship looks like in a sci-fi novel. The cover art is usually wrong or at least not quite right, and it gets distracting. If I'm not familiar with the car in general, that's like not knowing a technical term, I can look that up in a few minutes to get something useful.

Whenever I think of pictures of characters, I always think of the cover of Friday. She was described in the book as having very dark skin, but they made her pale with blonde hair. I know those pictures are accurate to what you think, which is interesting to see as an insight into your thoughts and your process, but coming up with a picture is part of the joy of reading.

one of the problems I have had for a long time is that I keep picturing Debbie as similar to my first girlfriend who had blonde hair. I KNOW that Debbie has very dark hair, but even when I correct for that, her appearance still fits the features of a blonde.

Quote:

t's, er, Not Done for a student to lose their wig/hair while out...

Hasn't happened yet, but Jessica does almost the same thing, though she at least has the foresight to ask first.

Quote:

"Magic's Pawn?"

Is there any significance to this book showing up in BOTH stories? First to Pam, now to Art. Vanyel's song, which he plays a couple times is "Shadow Lover"

Shadow-Lover, you alone can know
How I long to reach a point of peace
How I fade with weariness and woe
How I long for you to bring release.
Shadow-Lover, court me in my dreams
Bring the peace that suffering redeems.

He's a very depressed character. Also, might they think Tuck is gay because of the book? If Art's smart, he'll look into the books Tuck has read and recommends as an insight into how he thinks. I have trouble seeing the usual Jane student recommending THAT book.

Also a fun TS fact: the song (and all other songs sung by Vanyel) was sung on the album by Heather Alexander, who's now Alexander James Adams.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6932] Fri, 08 July 2011 23:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
stanman  is currently offline stanman
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ove the shopping Trip in 17, Wonder about the fallout though.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6933] Sat, 09 July 2011 01:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Sir Lee  is currently offline Sir Lee
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I don't have (much) of a problem with the Gallery, because I usually forget to check it until long after it ceased to be a spoiler... Very Happy

As for things like the car's appearance: It depends. I couldn't care less about Darla's BMW, for instance -- I have a general idea of what a BMW looks like, I could imagine the convertible version and... when I eventually looked at the photo, I was about right. Rich kid toy, not a lot of personality involved.

Same thing for the wigs and dresses, in fact -- I'm not interested on feminine fashions, so I hardly waste synapses visualizing how they looked. Even after seeing the photos, I can't bother to visualize the dresses in any detail.

The Roadrunner, though, was a different matter. I had to stop reading and Google for pics of one to have a better idea of what the car was like. This kind of custom engineering hits my cool-ometer. The presence of the Roadrunner suggests that it will take the place of <spoiler redacted> OK, it will take the place of that other customized car in the <spoiler redacted>, uh, in a later scene which I remember from the draft. Which, from this change alone, might end up being SUBSTANTIALLY different from the draft. When reading the original draft, I also had to research that car that shall remain nameless, for similar reasons...

[Updated on: Sat, 09 July 2011 01:31]


Don't call me Shirley. You will surely make me surly.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6953] Wed, 10 August 2011 14:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
lurker
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Doragoon wrote on Fri, 08 July 2011 00:00


Quote:

"Magic's Pawn?"

Is there any significance to this book showing up in BOTH stories? First to Pam, now to Art. Vanyel's song, which he plays a couple times is "Shadow Lover"

Shadow-Lover, you alone can know
How I long to reach a point of peace
How I fade with weariness and woe
How I long for you to bring release.
Shadow-Lover, court me in my dreams
Bring the peace that suffering redeems.

He's a very depressed character. Also, might they think Tuck is gay because of the book? If Art's smart, he'll look into the books Tuck has read and recommends as an insight into how he thinks. I have trouble seeing the usual Jane student recommending THAT book.


The kicker would be if Tuck decides after his choir lessons to sing or play this song, because as the Herald-Mage series explained, Shadow-Lover represented death. Since this arc takes place after his visit to his sister (which Art doesn't know anything about), Art could certainly be confused why he pick both the song and books. But unless Valerie actually volunteers to date a guy unprodded by Jane and her cohorts, Art should have no reason to suspect he's gay, just a well read nerd, which is what should confuse Art as to why Tuck is at Jane's in the first place.

Actually, I would think that Art might be more worried if Tuck thinks Diana and Jane are in a Lesbian relationship and Tuck was giving him the books as a not so subtle threat of public exposure...

[Updated on: Wed, 10 August 2011 14:43]

Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6954] Sat, 13 August 2011 18:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CaroL  is currently offline CaroL
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I dunno. Often a book is just a book. People derive enjoyment from a number of levels when reading a book, and sometimes it's just because it is well written. As far as Art getting insights from Tuck/Val's choice of books for him, did Val not say he had seen books that Art seemed to like and THAT guided his selection for him, in large part?

Anyway, I have had occasion to know a number of psych types, and there are many who wander off in their own directions guided by the stereotypes they learned during their schooling, and seem to forget the precept that every patient is different, seeking instead to pigeon hole them. Makes life easier if you can place people in neat little boxes you learned about while a student or doing a Piled Higher and Deeper (PhD).

If they are in a mood to be candid, most psychs may admit they often learn more from their patients than their patients get from them. No matter how long they have been practicing. It is always hard to get it right everytime despite the years of practice, ya' know?

CaroL
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6957] Mon, 15 August 2011 11:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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CaroL wrote on Sat, 13 August 2011 23:44

Anyway, I have had occasion to know a number of psych types, and there are many who wander off in their own directions guided by the stereotypes they learned during their schooling, and seem to forget the precept that every patient is different, seeking instead to pigeon hole them. Makes life easier if you can place people in neat little boxes you learned about while a student or doing a Piled Higher and Deeper (PhD).

Putting them in a pigeonhole also makes it much easier to get paid by insurance or Social Security or whomever. And this is sort of reflected in the last DSM I looked at, in which each category seemed to have an "X not otherwise specified" (they should've said 'described') as a possible diagnosis. I betcha ICD-9 or -10 is the same way.

Obviously, a good therapist should make a diagnosis for pay purposes, and then throw it away for actual use, but they're just as human as the rest of us (unfortunately).

Ellen
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6958] Mon, 15 August 2011 11:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ellen Hayes  is currently offline Ellen Hayes
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Doragoon wrote on Fri, 08 July 2011 00:00

Is there any significance to this book showing up in BOTH stories? First to Pam, now to Art.

Well, he's read it in both timelines. Also, it's IMO not quite as heroic, and thus MORE believable, than a lot of older fantasy. And it's got a gay hero/protagonist. And there's a main character that DIES. After doing something rather mean. And there are no quest coupons (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Tough_Guide_To_Fantasyland). So, it's kind of an interesting not-the-usual story, not the same-old.
lurker wrote on Wed, 10 August 2011 19:42

Actually, I would think that Art might be more worried if Tuck thinks Diana and Jane are in a Lesbian relationship and Tuck was giving him the books as a not so subtle threat of public exposure...

That's subtle IMO... though it would be reinforced when, er, something else.
What if Art decides that Tucker is telling them that he's gay? How would that warp their thoughts?
But then, what do the Walter Jon Williams and William Marshall then say?
And then Plagues And Peoples??
"It says you're a pestilential disease, Tuck, is what THAT one says."
Thanks, Mike.

Ellen
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6959] Mon, 15 August 2011 14:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mkemp  is currently offline mkemp
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I don't think that Kate Bishop's choir would do anything like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ5VNXIiv1c

Dunno why, but I like this best of all their other online clips.
Re: DOUBLE SHOT!! - #17 and #18 up. [message #6960] Thu, 18 August 2011 06:04 Go to previous message
Brooke  is currently offline Brooke
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mkemp wrote on Mon, 15 August 2011 11:17

I don't think that Kate Bishop's choir would do anything like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ5VNXIiv1c

Dunno why, but I like this best of all their other online clips.


Get your mind out of the gutter...


... you're blocking my snorkel.
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